much more ahead from here in charlotte. stay with cnn. good evening. welcome to charlotte's hottest hot spot. quite literally. the cnn grill. i'm here where the political elite meet, sometimes over a beer or two. patrick kennedy to ed rendell. plus reaction from the other side, a member of mitt romney's inner circle. my all-star panel will be meeting a little later.

san antonio mayor julian castro tossed out a lot of red meat in his keynote. i interviewed him tonight along with his brother. the big buzz tonight, of course, was the first lady michelle obama. the democrats' not so secret weapon. >> barack knows what it means when a family struggles. he knows what it means to want something more for your kids and grand kids. barack knows the american dream because he's lived it. and he wants everyone in this country, everyone to have the same opportunity no matter who we are or where we're from or what we look like or who we love. >> to break down michelle obama's speech, john king and gloria borger. apologizing for the heat in here. >> you've attracted quite a crowd. >> it's the sizzling energy bouncing off the place. i had the castro brothers who

were very dynamic and very impressive i thought tonight. michelle obama i thought knocked it out of the park as you americans would say. gloria, what did you think? >> yeah. i thought she did. if you were sort of a couch potato democrat, you're sitting at home and not sure you really like the president anymore and you don't have the same passion for him, she was talking to you tonight. and she said to you, well, if people can go serve overseas, the at least thing we can do is go vote. she made the case. she also said he's the same fellow i loved 23 years ago and he's the same guy you loved four years ago. >> she looked sensational, i thought. not too sexist to observe how the first lady dressed. she looked amazing. secondly i thought she really hit the right tone. it was crying out for exactly what she gave. not just the audience in the room but the audience at home. >> her biggest audience is the audience at home. the democrats come here knowing there's a bit of an enthusiasm

gap. republicans have an edge when it comes to voter enthusiasm. there's some disillusionment out there. you had a tough economy. you don't have the perfect storm president obama had four years ago. she said we have to work like we never did before. she touched every con tich wstc. you h the first lady's message was we have to work harder this time. they don't have the magic of 2008. he's been an incumbent for four years in a very difficult economy. what she's trying to make the case, she's fighting for you. maybe the economy hasn't been great for you. he's fighting for you. the other guy doesn't get you. >> what i thought, the poor republicans, it's not their fault, they had to put up with the hurricane which was taking all the attention away on the first day. even the second day to a large degree. the democrats come here. they launched off tonight with a

spectacular lineup of speakers. cory booker, duvall patrick, ted strickland, julian castro. before you got to michelle obama you had four really big, successful speeches. >> i don't know whether the democrats give great speeches or have better speech writers, but there were great speeches. >> and a coherent message. >> i think we got the feeling in tampa, don't forget, mitt romney was not everyone's first choice. mitt romney was a lot of people's second choice sitting in that room. tonight this was -- it's going to be the renomination of a president, a sitting president of the united states. and so the enthusiasm and the passion was there. inside the room. it's a bigger convention as other folks have pointed out. there was more energy in the room to begin with. then you had these great speakers and nobody was really saying look at me, i'm going to be the next president of the united states.

at least not yet. >> julian castro i thought made a real bid to be the first latino, potentially, president of the united states. >> there's no question there will be a lot of talk here about 2016. >> not yet. >> the main focus is on 2012 without a doubt. democrats were not mistake free today. their platform does not mention god. they changed that from four years ago. israel, jerusalem is the capital and israel is our strongest ally. a lot of people are going to scratch their head. why would you make those changes? we're trying to get answers on that. >> i also can't understand, why would you remove the word god? why would you deliberately allow the republicans to come in and go to all their base and say, look at this guy. he's removed the word god. >> we don't know the answer. >> somebody or somebodies made a mistake. somebody or somebodies in the campaign didn't catch it. in terms of the show they put on tonight, the show the american people put on, without a doubt they did a very good job. he's an incumbent president who

people believe it. do they listen to speeches or look at the unemployment rate? in terms of tv production, you're better at this than i am, they put on a good show. >> we heard this all four years ago. there were people in there chanting yes, we can, again. did they say, you know what? we've been through that already, and are they cynical? because these were not cynical speeches. >> a pretty good start. >> very good start. >> thanks, both, very much indeed. tonight, one of the democratic party's rising stars, san antonio mayor jewel oulian . mayor castro is in the blue tie. his brother is in the purple tie. >> what does the american dream really mean, do you think? how do you reinforce the kind of story that you guys can tell america? >> it means there's this -- as

joaquin has said many times he's campaigning for congress these days, but this sort of infrastructure of opportunity of strong public schools, of good universities, of student aid, of those things that it takes to experience opportunity in america. and america has been the land of opportunity. so it's -- our family is, i think, one example of that. but there's so many other examples. and the importance of tonight and of this election is which one of these candidates is going to ensure that america remains unquestionably the land of opportunity in the coming years. and tonight my speech was about why i'm convinced that's president barack obama. >> you gave mitt romney a few good zingers. i love the one about just ask your parents for the money. gee, i wish i'd thought of that. we were all having a chuckle of that. there was a clear line tonight drawn by almost every speaker. the difference between mitt romney's relationship with the e elect rat, particularly in terms

of personal wealth and you guys. you're obviously a good illustration of that perhaps more than the obamas in many ways. how much do you think that is going to come into play as a key factor at the election? do you think the american people are going to look at barack obama and mitt romney and say, this guy's a wealthy guy. he's out of touch with us. i prefer to go with the devil i know who's admitted he's only done half the job really? what do you think? >> what i think is that when folks compare where the nation was when president obama took office and you heard several speakers say that, losing 750,000 to 800,000 jobs a month, then you compare where we are now of 29 straight months of private sector job growth, 4.5 million new jobs, that i'm confident he's going to lay out the case for convincingly for why even though we haven't made the -- we're not where we want to be, we have made significant progress. and that means something very real for people's lives. you know, more students that are able to go to college. more folks now that are able to get back to work.

we see that in texas. so i don't think anybody would say we're where we want to be. but we're better positioned as a nation than we were in january of 2009. >> a lot of buzz tonight about your speech, as i say. electrified everybody. probably make some people say, wow, we haven't heard a speech like that since barack obama in 2004. this guy could be president. now, either of you could end up -- >> i'll leave that to him. if he becomes president i need secret service protection. >> my other question, if barack obama thought he had a problem with a name like barack obama becoming president, the first president castro of the united states of america is quite a moment. >> yeah. it's never going to happen. but i do grant you that florida would be pretty hard. >> congratulations. >> thank you very much. >> ground breaking speech. people are very excited. >> thank you. >> may the best man win. >> the castro brothers. i've got a feeling you might be hearing a little bit more from

at least one of them, probably both of them over the next few years. two special guests. former governor of pennsylvania ed rendell. former governor of new mexico. pretty first night i thought. i'll start with you. >> mayor castro was unbelievable. michelle obama did something very important. she cemented the likeability gap. the americans are loathe to change presidents. they've done it twice in recent years. when they like the family, she painted the picture of barack obama as a great -- not just a good but great family man. her likeability in her own right is through the roof. >> that was a spectacular performance tonight. >> i think she's the most -- probably the most popular person in the country. she sold barack that he's a father, he's a parent, he struggles, give him four more years. but julian castro, he's the new obama of the democratic party with that speech. hispanic, growing minority.

san antonio, economic growth mayor. they stole the show. it's a great start to our convention. >> yeah. i found him a fascinating character, julian castro. his story is incredibly inspiring. his brother and he, they're obviously -- they're a couple of rock stars, aren't they? >> they are. he has a great way of speaking. when he delivered that line about governor romney and handgun, it was hysterical. it was hysterical. >> let's move to the wider picture here which is the republicans had a bit of a tricky start to their convention. hurricanes were flying and so on. this has been a very disciplined start by the party. are you pleased to see that? >> i am. i think that the harping and the wining that you heard from some wings of the party is over. they're a unified party. but i think the president and the convention isn't just appealing to the base. i think there's a recognition we've got to speak to the next four years, the economic plan that we also have to recognize

that this election will be settled in a few states. it's going to be up to minorities, women, independent voters and young voters, and we got to get them motivated again. >> this whole mixed picture we've been getting about is america better off than it was four years ago, would it have been more honest for everyone to get together and say, look, here's the reality. we're better off than we were 3 1/2 years ago. for the first half of that first year, it was hell on earth. >> no question. the country is better off, significantly better off. stock market's doubled. gaining jobs instead of losing almost 1 million jobs a month, we've got health care for a lot of americans. we're doing great in many ways. but there are individual americans who are hurting. but we've got to keep the history in perspective. where we were and where we are today. there's been significant progress. not enough. the president's got to chart out in his speech how he's going to get us the next few steps. >> final question for you. we've got a couple of big

tribute videos tonight. jimmy carter. also ted -- >> i think to have jimmy carter, i think he emphasizes foreign policy. i think president obama has a very good foreign policy. he got rid of al qaeda. he did bin laden in. free trade agreements. agreements with russia on nuclear weapons. the arab spring. libya. he's a good foreign policy president. jimmy carter, the camp david agreements, talking about peace and human rights, i think gives that strong validation to president obama's foreign policy. >> i think that was very important. because governor romney made a very good speech. but the weakest part of his speech was foreign policy. iran, russia, if i'm an independent voter, i'm saying what in god's name is he talking about? >> we'll come back after the short break with two people to talk about the teddy kennedy tribute video. one is his son and one is his nephew.

joining me now, senator kennedy's son patrick kennedy, also former congressman from rhode island. and mark shriver, senior vice

president of save the children and author of trediscovering my father. welcome to all three of you. boiling hot. what will that be? is there something wrong with me? it's just the heat. i've got this red english head. very moving, i thought, the tribute to your father. what did you make of it watching from wherever you were in the convention hall? >> well, it was bittersweet. one because he wasn't there to be there in person. but he was there in spirit. that was also moving. because we could feel the power of his presence. all the people who fought for health care reform, we're all behind the president because he delivered on health care reform. anyway, i was just honored to be there, piers. and my whole family feels such an honor to have this chance to hear the good will towards him. but we understand the only way to advance the cause is to advance the president's cause because the president is the one who is in charge of public policy. and the difference between this

president and what we'd have under a president romney is stark. >> the moment that made me chuckle most in the middle of what was a very moving tribute, the throwback to the debate between teddy kennedy and mitt romney. when you saw a very young, handsome mitt romney bestowing the great virtues of a pro-choice abortion policy, obviously completely the opposite of what he now espouses. republicans are crying foul. it was a bit naughty. you shouldn't have been using that old footage. what did you make of it? >> you know, i guess i share your sense of irony on that. i mean, it was an incredible scene. i thought as patrick said it was a beautiful tribute. a great tribute for the edward m. kennedy institute also this afternoon. as patrick said, the president is really driving that policy forward. i really got the sense in listening to people, all the speakers tonight talking about the impact that obama care has had in their lives. that young woman who came out and talked about her child

having those open heart surgeries really tugged on my heart string. i'm a father of three young kids. my wife jeanne and i, if that happened in our house, i didn't know that existed. and to hear her tell it so beautifully and see the positive impact of the legislation that uncle teddy worked on, it was a great night. >> i thought it was a terrific endorsement. the videos were superb for teddy kennedy but also for jimmy carter. you know, who is a maligned figure in many ways. i admit, i found him a great character. if i look anything as good as he does at 87, i will be very, very happy. what did you think tonight in totality? more importantly, you have heard a big piece this week about president clinton and obama's relationship. and tomorrow night we will have the big speech from president clinton. what are your thoughts? >> first, on kennedy, it's interesting how much the end of his life was wrapped up in the most important moment of obama's life, right?

kennedy gave obama a very important endorsement in the primaries. and frankly, i'm not so sure obama would have pursued health care without the push from ted kennedy early on in the administration. really staked his presidency on ted kennedy's number one priority. on clinton tomorrow night, you know, presidents and current presidents and previous presidents always have really fraught relationships. bill clinton did not have a good relationship with jimmy carter. he felt like carter freelanced all the time. and obama after the vicious primaries of 2008 where it got really, really personal between president clinton and then senator obama, they had a lot to overcome. and there really wasn't much of a reaching out or relationship all through 2009 and most of 2010. >> then it was all love on the golf course, wasn't it? they all got together, whacked a few golf balls? >> what happened was one of obama's political advisors and called clinton advisors and said

we want you to do campaign events and they said no. that's not how it works. you want bill clinton to do campaign events you've got to build a relationship between these two guys. let's get them out on the golf course. >> is it better now? >> it's better. i'll be honest. nobody on either side of this relationship tried to argue to me these two guys are good friends. sometimes they would argue the opposite. it's a complicated relationship. it's a mutually advantageous relationship. >> they kind of need each other. >> they need each other. bill clinton along with michelle obama are the only two people, national political figure, democrats, whose approval ratings are in the 60s. it's a no-brainer to get this guy on his team. >> funny. clinton's right hand man was going to vote mitt romney. he furiously tenied this. it doesn't mean very much. >> what was strange, he wouldn't deny it to me. two democrats very, very knowledgeable about this told me

he regularly says he's going to vote for mitt romney. when i asked bends to go on the record and dispute this, he wouldn't do it. today after i understand some pressure from people in the clinton world he came out and said that he does support president obama. >> you're standing 100% by your story? >> standing by the fact that two democrats said he said this and he would not deny -- would not go on the record with a response to me. >> thank you all. >> thanks. next, democrats on the attack. i'll talk with the chairwoman of the dnc, debbie wasserman schultz. [ male announcer ] if you believe the mayan calendar,

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mitt romney, quite simply, doesn't get it. a few months ago, he visited a university in ohio and gave students there a little entrepreneurial advice. start a business, he said. but how? borrow money if you have to, from your parents, he told them.

gee, why didn't i think of that? >> the democratic party's rising new star, san antonio mayor julian castro, firing up the crowd and attacking mitt romney in tonight's keynote address. joining me is florida congresswoman debbie wasserman schultz. chairwoman of the dnc. welcome. >> thank you. >> when you kicked all of this off most neutral observes felt pretty good tonight. a lot of good speeches. mr. castro i interviewed earlier particularly effective. obviously michelle obama brought the house down. what was your feeling when you finished up? >> pride. i'm so proud of our leadership. i'm proud that this is a convention that we kicked off as the most open and inclusive convention that really american politics has seen. and the story that michelle obama and julian castro told tonight essentially said if you work hard and play by the rules, then everyone in america deserves an opportunity to be successful.

compare that to the idea that it's only people who already are successful that should be able to have someone go to bat for them. >> some weird omissions from the democratic platform which no one can quite understand how or why this happened or what the intention was. all it's going to do is rattle cages that don't need to be rattled. no mention of the word god even though there was last time and about ten times in the republican platform. why is that? >> well, we have a commitment through all faith traditions that our values are reflected in our policy. and that means that we should look out for the least of these. that we should fight for the middle class. that we should help everyone in america have an opportunity to be successful. >> was the word "god" deliberately taken out or was it a mistake. >> oh, of course not. we have a platform that actually reflects the values of many faith traditions. it's the policies -- >> somebody has deliberately taken out the word "god." because it was in the last one. >> i can assure you no one has

sli deliberately taken god out of our platform. >> so it was an accident? >> what i can tell you is that our policies and our values are reflected in many faith traditions. that's what our platform is all about. >> what about the other strange comments which came out about israel and jerusalem? jerusalem is and will remain the capital of israel. that was in the 2008 platform. no longer there. also this idea that israel was the closest ally of america in the middle east, that's also come out. why would they come out? >> throughout our platform it is very clear that president obama and democrats are committed to maintaining a strong u.s./israel relationship, maintaining israel and supporting israel as a jewish and democratic state and ensuring that we have the strongest possible language. not stronger than the language the republicans have used on assuring iran can never achieve a nuclear weapon. our platform actually says that we are committed to ensuring

that we use all the instrumentation available to us to ensure that iran never achieves a nuclear weapon. the republicans simply say all options are on the table. in words and in deeds, president obama has stood by israel and always will. >> mitt romney is 4% up in the polls in north carolina. are you worried about that? >> you know, we're focused on continuing to run the most significant dynamic grass roots presidential campaign. we have been here in north carolina since before 2008 and we've never left. and we have an incredible grass roots operation here. our voter registration drives have been incredibly successful. we're focused on the next 63 days and making sure that we can help use the people power that we get and the momentum we get out of this convention to carry barack obama back to the white house. >> finally, you tried to arrange for michelle obama to make speeches every hour on the hour every day? >> wouldn't that be nice? >> id be getting her out there. >> she spoke from her heart tonight and spoke as a mom. as a fellow mom i completely

identified with what she was talking about. because we all want what's best for our children and we want someone in the white house going at bat for their future every single day like barack obama has been. >> her husband may be a divisive figure as always goes with the president. but his wife is universally popular. >> deservedly so. >> coming next, the romney camp will fire back.

we're back here live in the cnn grill. where it's very, very hot. rather like the politics. a lot of anger from the republicans. bound to be, isn't there? day one of the democratic convention, they're going to be furious. who better to be furious than mitt romney's communication director. what are you furious about? you're bound to be about something. >> no. i think that michelle obama gave a great speech tonight. but there are some really big takeaways here from the democrat national convention. that's what you didn't hear tonight. first of all, you didn't hear

president obama or any of his surrogates tonight talking about the fact that americans are not better off than they were four years ago. there's been all kinds of discussions about whether we are better off than we were four year ace go. the reason we went six hours without having one surrogate -- >> would you agree that we are better off than we were 3 1/2 years ago? >> no. because we still have 23 million people unemployed. >> the first half year of barack obama obama was just a financial meltdown. brought on by eight years of republican administration. >> let's go back and look at his promises. we can look at his promises from his convention speech four years ago where he said he was going to create more jobs and get the debt down. i think it is very symbolic of something you didn't hear. the national debt reached $16 trillion. that's very substantial.

you did not hear the democrats talking about how to get that debt down for our children and grandchildren. >> before we get into the nitty-gritty of broken promises, we did see an extraordinary bit of video in the teddy kennedy tribute which had your guy, mitt romney, apparently saying on the record in a debate he's pro-choice when it comes to abortion. what surprised me is not that he flip-flop on that. we know about that. he was 47 years old. i'm 47 years old. much as i'd love to be a spring chicken, i'm not. i'm a fully rounded adult. is it really conceivable his view just evolved? or is it not more likely it was political expediency. >> a couple things there, piers. first of all, none of this is new. governor romney is pro-life. he will govern as a pro-life president. everybody has been very clear on the fact he's pro-life. if you're talking about changing positions, then look at what president obama has done with gay marriage. he became president campaigning on the fact that he believed that marriage was between a man and a woman and now he's for gay

marriage. >> was it wrong of the democrats to use that footage? >> i think that we have a lot bigger problems to worry about than what the democrats are doing with their web videos. but what i'll tell you is that what wasn't seen in there is that despite the political differences, which there are many, if not most, if not all between governor romney and ted kennedy, was that they have a mutual respect for each other even after a very hard fought senate race in massachusetts back in the '90s. >> when you are mitt romney's communications director and you're here in charlotte, north carolina, in the middle of thousands of democrats, is it a lonely place to find yourself? >> no, we're talking about the things that the democrats are not. what you didn't hear again tonight, piers, is any democrat talking about whether or not we're better off because they can't talk about that we're better off because we're not. >> their argument is now that they inherited the mother of all -- >> sure. you're going to see blaming. you're going to see scapegoats. this is not about running against president bush. if they wanted to run against

president bush they're eight years too late. president bush is not on the ballot. you will continue to hear these excuses, this blame shifting, this scapegoating because they have no record to run on. and president obama has no plans in the future to fix it. >> finally, michelle obama's dress, a win? >> oh, great. great dress. great speech. she's a great first lady. >> a happy note of contented agreement. happy to see you again. >> nice to see you. when we come back, my all-star panel. we're going to get into all these issues and find out what the truth is if we can.

welcome back to the cnn grill here in charlotte in north carolina. it is still boiling hot outside and in. so is all the political gossip

and intrigue. mitt romney's foreign policy spokesman, editor of townhall.com and author of "fast and furious: barack obama's bloodiest scandal and the coverup," hilary rosen. how to rebuild the dream and author of rebuild the dream. welcome to you all. you are thinking yeah. >> i'm in love again. >> boys and girls. >> i'm in love again. >> let me start with you. i watched you this morning on tv. you actually got quite emotional about the prospect of a michelle obama speech and what it meant. having watched it now what do you think? >> it was more powerful than i thought. i was fl there in the hall. it was like a revival. i remember as a kid we would go to church after the summertime, people were lackadaisical about their faith. somebody would come out and

restore the faith. she was a mom and she was a revivalist. for her to come out with dignitary and grace. for her to set the bar in oratory, it was powerful. >> the irony, the two best speeches so far arguably were ann romney, now michelle obama. >> i think that's right. i think julian castro did a great job, too. michelle obama didn't just talk about the heart which i think we saw from ann romney. she actually talked about policy and what barack obama has done for the country and why it's good for families, why it's good for america. that was an unusual thing for a first lady to come out and do sort of a litany of how policy is connected to people's lives. i thought that was really impressive. >> rick, if you were still there with old governor romney you'd be thinking, dammi tirt, day on get a hurricane and they get a different hurricane, a verbal hurricane.

a series of speeches. not a good day for republicans, you could say. >> i think michelle did a great job. i have been to a lot of revivals. we have heard a lot of this before. the democrats have to be very careful. they cannot replicate 2008. i'm here in charlotte. i don't feel that energy that we did in 2008. i think they have got be very careful. the other thing i would say, they have a big problem on their hands right now with israel. the platform does not say that jerusalem is the capital of israel. that was in 2008. >> we'll come to that in a moment. that was an odd thing to me. they left out the word god. which to me seemed needlessly clumsy. the israel stuff i thought was just really odd, to change the wording and to make those kinds of admissions in a platform just to create some kind of -- i didn't get it. >> where it was in 2008 it's not here now. the spin is that apac signed off

on it. and we're finding out apac did not sign off. democrats are going to have to answer to what happened. >> i think going back to michelle obama's speech, i think she did a great job. she did talk about president obama's record in a very vague sense. she did discuss how president obama needs more time but she didn't talk about why or the fact that we reached $16 trillion in debt today. she didn't talk about the fact that women's unemployment rate has jumped a percentage point under president obama. she didn't talk about the povr rate going up under president obama. she did talk about personal experiences, but she really didn't get into what her husband's record is in his first term. >> she's his wife. she's not going to stand in front of billions of people and start banging on about all the negatives. >> but if she's going to talk about why he needs more time, why does he need more time? that's a question they're going to have to answer. >> did you feel uncomfortable as a woman watching mitt romney espousing the great joys of pro-choice? >> what i felt uncomfortable with is a convention that stands for women and fighting the so-called war on women they would pick ted kennedy who left

a woman in his car to drown to be the person in that video. that's how uncomfortable i was. >> that's a bit below the belt. hillary? >> one of the things we saw with the democrats this weekend and it goes to the platform, this is not sort of a point by point sock to the right wing the way the republican platform has been. the democratic platform is broadly supporting the middle class. we don't have a platform that we're running away from. like mitt romney did. i think what we saw tonight was the very clear choice that voters are going to face, right? as julian castro said, it's not about government, but government can help. it's student loans. it's public education. those sorts of things you can't ignore in a new economy. that's something we haven't seen -- >> julian castro, whn i interviewed him and his brother here, very, very impressive. amazing story. the idea that these two young

lads have come effectively from an orphaned young woman, their grandmother who came to san antonio from mexico with nothing and then had to get away from school halfway through schooling to try and find some money for the family, there are these two boys. i think they went to stanford and harvard. they're potentially both future presidential candidates. >> here's where i think we have some common ground. if we're looking for common ground both parties understand the american dream is under threat. you saw both parties trying to tell american dream stories. everybody was talking about if it wasn't them it was their parent, great grandparent, somebody had to be the american dream carrier. i think it's important to recognize both parties understand the dream is under threat. we have different visions on what to do about it. i tell you what, when it comes to authenticity, i was moved by mitt romney's speech. i was certainly moved by ann romney's speech. the authenticity scale when michelle obama starts talking about her story, those castro brothers talk about their story, it just resonates differently.

i'm glad both parties recognize the dream's under threat and both want to move the ball. >> there's a difference in that. i believe both parties want to promote the idea that if you work hard in america you can actually succeed. the difference is, is this party here, the democrats, are really trying to say that government has a fundamental hand in that process where i think the republicans are just simply saying that's not true. >> i think you're right. we are saying government has a fundamental hand. not the only hand. >> i don't want you all agreeing with each other. that's not the idea at all. let's take a short break. >> republicans want it to be -- >> i'm going to stop you because you're on the dream team. we're going to regroup, have a beer. i'm going to have a great cold shower to get rid of all the heat. coming not just from here but the panelists. we're back to answer the big question. is america better off or not because of barack obama? >> now it's going to get hot. ordinary rubs don't always work on my arthritis.

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we're back with my all-star panel. so you've all been squabbling away on the break, very nicely

coming to the boil. let's get to the crux of what this whole issue can come down to. the very uncomfortable question. is america better off or not because of four years of barack obama? my argument would have been for them, you know what? the first six months were a nightmare. since then you've been better off. because they've made a four-year assessment from the point of election to now, the stats don't really work for barack obama on most common ground you look at to compare like with like, he's not in good shape. how do you dispute the fact it doesn't look like we are in better shape in america? >> there are stats on both sides. we look at the all-time high stock market. gdp growth up. we were hemorrhaging 800,000 jobs a month. now we're growing. not enough, but -- >> unemployment has gone up. gas prices -- there are key economic dynamics which look terrible. >> on both sides. >> only one side's in government. >> i mean both sides.

some numbers are worse. some numbers are better. here's the key point. democrats could be stupid if we tried to tell people how they feel. so the best we're going to do, i think, is to say, you know what? we do not want to go back to where we were in 2008. we do not want to go back to the policies that brought us there. we don't want to go back to the situation we were where the banks were out of control, where war was out of control, where tax cuts were out of control. >> poor old president obama. he wakes up and suddenly remembers, we're in two wars. we've got the worst financial crisis since the great depression. this is the mother of all -- >> he ran for president to fix the problem. he hasn't fixed the problem. there are 23 million people out of work. the food stamp count is at an all record high. people at the gas purpose cmp c it. his closest advisers have said you can't tell people it's okay,

everything's not okay and they'll think you're lying to them. >> it's slowly improving. >> it's not, though. >> unemployment has gone up. >> clearly over the last two years, you have seen signs of improvement. the stock market performance is a sign of economic prosperity. compared to where it was. >> the democrats controlled the house, the senate and the white house for two years. >> filibusters, though. >> that's such an excuse. really you could do anything that you want. nancy pelosi could wake up and put any piece of legislation on the table and they would have had to vote on it. >> what about -- >> if they didn't like it the president can veto. >> what about the undeniable reality the republicans have done everything they can to stymie this guy. they made it very clear very publicly early on -- >> i think they have proven to be right. i think if we tried what the

republicans had offered we wouldn't be in this mess. >> to say that the republicans are the problem here, the democrats still have the senate, they still have the white house. republicans have passed multiple budgets. the senate has not introduced a budget for more than 1,200 days. which has a direct impact on job growth in this country. >> let me get in here. let me say a couple things. first of all, we don't actually have a dictatorship. we have a democracy. we have two parties. one party says they are a party of individual responsibility. they need to take some responsibility for the fact that republicans have been acting like lucy holding the ball. every time obama tries to kick it they move the ball. republicans have not voted for their own policies when it comes to tax cuts for small businesses. tax breaks for 98% of americans. so both parties have to take some responsibility here, number one. number two, you know, i think the truth that nobody wants to say on either side, some americans are doing better and some americans are not. it's the income inequality that makes this thing hard to talk about. some are doing better, some are doing worse. that's the reality. >> i'm afraid we've got to leave it there. you can come